Comments: Welcome to Swedenistan

Personally and philosophically, in an ideal world, I'll take the open borders and pass on the welfare state (TM). But we're not living in anything close to an ideal world. Until then we need regulated national borders.

Don't get me started on the Welfare State. I'll just start swearing and spitting and people will want to call me vile names.

Posted by johngalt at February 21, 2017 3:57 PM

I hate to hijack a good immigration argument. Mostly because everyone else is so wrong and I am so right. But I wanted to ask a different question about Sweden, videlicet, "Whaaaa????"

I am out of credible sources. Some bright and fiercely conservative folks at Friends of Best of the Web on Facebook were joining Reason to say that there really is no sizable problem in Sweden, beyond the cold and that horrid smell of lutefisk.

The rape stats are like those on a US college campus, they say, reports are up because the definition has changed. Convictions are not following because many of the claims are frivolous.

The Facebook wars rage on. My conservatives (other conservatives) post scores of videos and articles showing it to be "a hellhole" and "a war zone."

I have been seeing these for long enough that I had internalized them. When the kerfuffle struck, I immediately took the President's side. "Well," I thought, "to be fair they do have a lot of problems. I had heard of no-go areas for western women and even law enforcement." But are those true?

My lefty friends are in full Jon Stewart, CODE-4 SMUG alert. There has not been a crime in Sweden since 1924 and that stoopid Trump fellow is fabricating again.

I got no idear and would be interested in believeable assessments.

Posted by jk at February 21, 2017 4:18 PM

Accepting that there is significant trouble in Europe from Muslim immigration, I'm still not onboard with Trump-Sessionsism.

Conservatives telling me we have to close the borders because of Sweden rhyme with Progressives' calling to emulate Swedish health care or Danish education. These are small countries with small populations and small economies. I suggest neither their problems nor solutions necessarily scale.

I'll concede Europe might be an argument against "open borders." With very little to do with welfare, rather, can a tolerant, pluralistic society accept overwhelming numbers of residents without those qualities. Consider me reevaluating.

BUT, this is not the discussion today.

We do not have rafts of refugees crashing on our shores. We were discussing our nation of 300,000,000 allowing 10,000 - 30,000 refugees for humanitarian reasons, all of whom would be vetted on some level.

Not only are we not going to allow that, we're going to kick out graduate students and foreign workers if they come from "scary" places.

Not my vision of freedom. Not my vison of courage. Certainly not my vision of prosperity.

Posted by jk at February 21, 2017 4:56 PM

Um, the borders ARE closed. There is a big, beautiful, wall of legality obstructing the free immigration of anyone from anywhere at anytime. All of the law abiding folks stop at that wall. Unfortunately, there are those pesky lawless peeps.

And even the so-called "muslim ban" of the seven Obama nations is not a closing of the border. It is a pause. You know, so that we can impose a vetting process that includes meeting everyone face-to-face, at least.

The grad students and foreign workers were an error, fixed by direction to the relevant agencies, but still not good enough for a grandstanding judiciary. So there will be a new order that puts it in writing. If they keep up the pissing contest with the President then we have a genuine article constitutional crisis.

P.S. Ninety days.

Posted by johngalt at February 21, 2017 6:22 PM

Interesting reading at www.whyileftsweden.com.

Including Swedish Police Release Extensive Report Detailing Control of 55 'No-Go Zones' By Muslim Criminal Gangs.

Posted by johngalt at February 21, 2017 6:31 PM

I'm hip with JG's comment:

I'll take the open borders and pass on the welfare state
I'll even take a chance on curtain #3!

I took a quick look at 'WhyILeftSweden' as part of my research and thought it a tad too fringe-y.

I can only add that of scores swedes from Ericsson that took Long Term Assignments in the U.S. all but one stayed. of the americans that took LTA's in Sweden, none stayed.

Posted by nanobrewer at February 23, 2017 1:17 AM
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