June 20, 2007

Celebrating the Bush Presidency

I'm going to call blogger prerogative and promote a comment thread into a new post. To get the current thread, read this post or this for some superb guest commentary. What started a few posts before as a discussion of the debate contretemps between Rep. Ron Paul and Mayor Rudy Giuliani morphed into a discussion of pragmatism and what might be the great question of politics: in a Madisonian system, how far do you go to seek a candidate you truly agree with and when do you tolerate the lesser of two evils?

The newest turn questions President Bush. Perry Eidelbus parries my defense of W:

Besides, what has Bush done to deserve accolades? Tax cuts, excellent. Private health savings accounts, good. Pushing for Social Security reform, fine. But the rest of his administration has been raping the Constitution, whether it's out-Hitlering Giuliani with the "Patriot" Act, or out-Demming the Democrats with everything from NCLB to the prescription drug bill. Bruce Bartlett calls the latter the worst legislation ever passed, and he could be right.

I’ll be one of the 29% or whatever who will defend this President. I don’t claim he has aligned closely with my beliefs, but several aspects of his administration have been very positive. My list of achievements is longer than yours:

  • You left out the best, my friend: the appointment of Chief Justice John Roberts and Associate Justice Samuel Alito. Two inspired choices, confirmed.

  • The tax cuts are a massive achievement. The continued defense has been solid (legislatively, I think the rhetoric could be a lot better).

  • Publicly sharing the Senate’s 0-95 vote for Kyoto with the rest of the world.

  • Toppling the Taliban in Afghanistan

  • Toppling Saddam Hussein in Iraq (yup, I still score that as a plus. I’m a Sharanskyite and consider an unstable free society a step up from a stable fear society).

  • Allowing Yassir Arafat’s PA government to fall instead of propping it (and Arafat) up with White House visits, summits, extra aid and diplomacy.

  • Appointing Mark McClellan to the FDA (sadly, too short lived)

  • Appointing Paul Wolfowitz to the World Bank, then Robert Zoellick after the professional thieves chased him out. Even National Review took a break from Bush bashing this week to highlight those two exceptional choices.
  • John Bolton to UN (also, sadly, too short a tenure).

You applaud HSAs and Social Security private accounts then decry NCLB and Medicare Part D. I lump them all into his idea of an “ownership society.” He is willing (too willing perhaps but hang in there) to trade some Federal control or additional spending to infuse a free market incentive structure. This pragmatist imagines that the additional spending and regulation are coming either way. The structure might pay long term benefits.

These accomplishments have come with a narrow Congressional majority, a sharply divided electorate and the most extreme exogenous events that any President since Lincoln has encountered. To return to my Bush vs. Congress argument, I’d say that a braver, more visionary Congressional caucus could have accomplished even more.

President Bush Posted by John Kranz at June 20, 2007 2:52 PM

I'm with JK on this one and I will add in that I like the prescription drug bill.
If you recall people were clamoring for "free prescription drugs for seniors" back then.
This benefit was a compromise amongst a lot of people that is actually working well.

Since then, you heard what a fiasco it was. It was too hard. Well, yeah. Insurance and choosing insurance bites. Why? There is too much information and basically we want things simple. Well - now that it's out there, people are finding they like it. And it wasn't too hard. And it's helping them.
Dems didn't want this bill because they wanted a govt run free prescription program. Seniors were clamoring and the GOP needed to this. It's a nation of compromise.
I believe that in the long run, with prescription drugs being coverred through medicare that we're going to find a reduction in our tax dollars used for emergency senior care.

Posted by: Terri at June 20, 2007 5:44 PM

Roberts and Alito were mostly good choices, but I have a feeling their conservativism will bite us sooner or later.

Oh, and nominating Alito was after the debacle of nominating Harriet Miers. Leadership means taking charge, but it doesn't mean you can make your base wonder what the hell you're smoking.

The tax cuts are just about the only good thing Bush has done, but his rhetoric has been poor. What he needs is a halfway decent economist to explain that supply-siderism works, and how, and how the rich may get wealthy but it *always* flows back into the economy. I can't really leave my job, otherwise, all modesty aside, I'm the one he needs.

"Publicly sharing the Senate’s 0-95 vote for Kyoto with the rest of the world." I say, so what? If Bush wanted to be tough, he'd have no fear of alienating the tree-huggers. He would have said that we're not going to enter into treaties that will cripple our economy because of inconclusive, if not unsound, science.

"Toppling the Taliban in Afghanistan" More like, removing them from power. We're fighting a limited war in Afghanistan and Iraq, where we're afraid to crush our enemies and break their descendents' will to fight. That's why we'll ultimately lose unless we truly change tactics. BTW, I've opposed the surge, not because I'm against fighting in Iraq, but because 20,000 more troops won't do any good if we don't let them fight.

"Toppling Saddam Hussein in Iraq (yup, I still score that as a plus. I’m a Sharanskyite and consider an unstable free society a step up from a stable fear society)." See above. For all our mistakes, I think we still went in for the right reasons, but damn it, we need to fight for real.

"Allowing Yassir Arafat’s PA government to fall instead of propping it (and Arafat) up with White House visits, summits, extra aid and diplomacy." Look again. Bush only waited for Arafag (no typo) to die. In late 2005, he was all too eager to give $50 million of OUR dollars to the Palestinian Authority. Why? So the government could create jobs for the thugs.

http://eidelblog.blogspot.com/2005/11/absolutism-of-most-middle-east.html

"Appointing Mark McClellan to the FDA (sadly, too short lived)" Big deal. How about abolishing the FDA?

I'll give credit for Wolfowitz, Zoellick and Bolton, but those haven't had much if any impact on our daily lives. Bush's profligate spending *has*.

Now, um, are we talking about the same NCLB that federalized? Our nation is one of federalism, where the states retain most of the power, in contrast to a *federalized* system. What Bush did with NCLB

The long-term costs of Medicare Part D are expected to be greater than Social Security. That's a *federal* projection, which is always on the low end. How can you defend the indefensible? This is not Ronald Reagan accepting the continuation of welfare programs so he could slash the top income tax rate from 70% to 50%, then further to 28%. This is George W. Bush cutting taxes modestly, albeit doing a good thing, so he could *expand* the federal government.

So Terri, you support the taking of money from some people to give to others? Just be blunt.

It's helping *some* people, namely the recipients and the bureaucrats. Of course they're going to love getting things for *free*, because they don't have to pay for them. The program is simultaneously hurting *others*, namely me and everyone else paying the programs. God damn, let me be perfectly blunt: do you think the money comes out of thin air?

Let me guess, you're getting free or discounted prescription drugs at my expense?

"Seniors were clamoring and the GOP needed to this. It's a nation of compromise." The GOP needed to do it because they needed to buy votes. In the end, your notion of "compromise" only means higher taxes and/or higher debt. There's no way around the reality that someone will have to pay.

"I believe that in the long run, with prescription drugs being coverred through medicare that we're going to find a reduction in our tax dollars used for emergency senior care."

What you believe is a far cry from reality. Everyone, from the feds to Democrats to the most anti-Part D libertarians (like me), projects that the costs will keep going up. Look at Massachusetts and its small-scale taste of nationwide HillaryBarackCare will be: after just a year, the WSJ reported, costs and expenditures were up 150% from initial estimates, and they weren't even covering everyone they wanted. What *would* it take to cover everyone, 200%? Maybe 250% once they did all the advertising?

The private sector advertises to convince you to spend your money in a certain way. Government advertises to convince you to make others spend money on you in a certain way.

Posted by: Perry Eidelbus at June 21, 2007 1:04 PM

Addendum, Terry. Life is all about choices. The fact that a government program minimizes the trouble for some is, however, offset by the fact that I am paying for *their* convenience.

Of course people like things that are made free or lower-cost. They're not the ones paying. Why should *I* have to subsidize, against my will, other people's choices that benefit them and not me?

Posted by: Perry Eidelbus at June 21, 2007 1:07 PM

I was expecting a Harriet Miers reference; again, you praise the dog when it does come to you.

If I could wave my magic legislative wand and accomplish one legislative priority it would definitely be to privatize the FDA. I've called for it as long as I have been blogging. Yet I recognize it as a quixotic quest. To have the President appoint a guy like McClellan: an MD with a PhD in economics that understands the importance of the private sector in pharmaceutical development, is the best that we can ask. To deny Bush credit for McClellan because he didn't abolish the FDA is unfair.

Likewise, Medicare D. (Terri and) I recognize that subsidizing health care for seniors is wildly popular. Politicians who suggest that it should grow at 9% instead of 11% are accused of raiding granny's purse and are not re-elected. Recognizing that subsidies will be made, isn't it better to buy a bottle of Plavix instead of treating a heart attack?

Had Bush's plan not been done, do you think we'd have put that money on our pockets? We'd've gotten a Democratic plan that would not include any private insurance.

Also with you on RomneyCare, enough so that I never looked at support the "Governor of the Commonwealth." Interesting to note that Part D produced lower premiums and less spending than was budgeted -- because it was based on free market principles.

NCLB is grey. I'm all for local control of the schools. But on this planet, that's not how it works. The AFT and NEA have effectively nationalized the schools. NCLB should not be needed, but the education system is so badly broken, Bush tried to buy accountability with Federal largesse. It's not my favorite but I do see it as part of the ownership society with the tax cuts, HSAs, private Social Security accounts, and Part D.

I would have loved to have you on board to explain Bush's economic policies (instead of your buddy, Bruce Bartlett who failed so miserably but got a nice book deal). I have been complaining a lot lately about this administration's inability to articulate. What was cute in 2001 has become a threat to liberty in 2007. I am going to pick a great orator in 2008.

Posted by: jk at June 21, 2007 2:17 PM

JK, you said it well.

Perry, you like to be blunt. Well, to be blunt you sound like you'd be just miserable to be around. I happen to think that a lot of governing involves compromise not only amongst the governing bodies but amongst the people with their government itself. You jump right into accusing me of wanting to spend your hard earned dollars on me. I'm pretty sure I've avoided you at parties before.

The people wanted "free drugs". The left wanted "free everything but especially drugs". The right wanted old people on their side. The pharmaceutical companies wanted money. The HMOs wanted a piece. This prescription drug bill is a whole lot less of a give away than what you would have seen with someone other than Bush in office. (oh - unless you were there)

Let's talk in 5 years and see how much more this drug bill has become. It's already less than projected.

Why should you have to subsidize, against your will, other people's choices that benefit them and not me?
Well - shall we go into the basics about being a part of society. I have no children and yet I get to pay for schools, I carry insurance and yet I get to pay for the Katrina disaster, I subsidize the railroads and the airlines and the roads and it goes on and on as you well know. (Don't bother. I'm sure you think everyone should just cover themselves and school themselves etc. I find a little benefit to having relatively educated people here and knowing there is a safety net in times of disaster)

Life is about choices. And sometimes its the voters who choose for you. The voters either felt sorry for seniors (no I'm not personally using your tax dollars yet), and the politicians got tired of all the "news" stories about seniors halving pills in order to make them last longer. The pharmaceutical companies, the left, the right, the hmos and the old folks all contributed to this bill. And frankly it's a good one. Perhaps not to you who would rather live in a cave and not be a part of society, but to many others it's working out. Should we even have medicare at all? Maybe not. But we do.

I don't think the money comes out of thin air. I think the bill is working out better than projected. Like I said, we'll talk later and look at the numbers.

Posted by: Terri at June 21, 2007 11:56 PM

Wow. A fight at ThreeSources and I am not in it.

Before someone's mother is purported to be a hamster, I'll be happy to stipulate that, without having ever met either Terri or Perry, I doubt either is on the public dole and both would be fun to have at a party.

It's usually JohnGalt and I running this thread, but I have no problem accepting that we have way too much government intrusion and am content to fight it at the margins.

It's legitimate to say that the Constitution clearly forbids this and to refuse to play along, but I try to talk people out of it at every opportunity. I'll rest my case that Bush, with flaws known and unknown, was better than VP Gore. Those who refused to support him out of ideological purity almost gave us President Gore and might likely give us President (HR) Clinton in 2008. I don't see where the cause of liberty is served.

Posted by: jk at June 22, 2007 11:45 AM

The thing about Miers is that it's just one example of where, as Stephen Bainbridge put it, Bush pissed away the conservative movement. Bush is the ultimate party man, let's face it, who will do anything, try to please anybody, so his party remains in power. It wasn't enough in 2006, and it may not be enough in 2008.

It's bad enough when you piss away your support to woo the middle. It's sheer stupidity to piss away your support and still botch the job so badly that you don't win the middle.

"To deny Bush credit for McClellan because he didn't abolish the FDA is unfair."

But what's happened at the FDA, despite someone supposedly qualified better more than anyone? The same thing. Nothing significant has happened, despite someone who on the surface appears significantly better than his predecessor(s).

As much as I admire John Bolton, and meeting him was a terrific evening, it's the same sort of tilting at windmills: appointing one man alone can't do anything. To change the FDA requires legislation limiting its power, properly restoring it to American individuals. To change the UN requires that the U.S. give it the finger, completely withdraw from it,a nd send dunning notices for the money THEY owe us (and I'm talking about more than parking tickets).

"Likewise, Medicare D. (Terri and) I recognize that subsidizing health care for seniors is wildly popular."

Of course it's popular. I recognize it too, but I further state that it's popular for those on the receiving end, not those who pay for it. I pull no punches and call it what it is: robbing Peter to pay for Paul.

Prison sodomy is popular for at one side, you know.

"Politicians who suggest that it should grow at 9% instead of 11% are accused of raiding granny's purse and are not re-elected. Recognizing that subsidies will be made, isn't it better to buy a bottle of Plavix instead of treating a heart attack?"

You and I know very well that government programs never confine themselves to practical expenditures of money. Now, we have no idea, and no one short of God ever will, that Plavix will have any significant preventitive value now, compared to the cost of a hospital visit later on. As a windfall for pharmaceutical companies, Part D allows them to produce as much as doctors can prescribe. And when the federal government, through Medicare and Medicaid, pays for so many people, why should doctors turn down patients who'll just be given a new prescription?

If you truly support free markets, you'll recognize that the value of an item changes over time. A bottle of a prescription drug today, based on a person's risk of a heart attack later on, could be less or more than the cost of a hospital visit. If the person never has a heart attack, then the drugs were a waste. We won't know, but in a truly free market, each individual can make his own judgment -- just not at the expense of others. Here I go from the economic to the moral argument.

Why should I be compelled to pay for someone else, against my will? People should be motivated to take care of themselves, whether financially, physically or mentally. They should not be motivated to vote for someone who will give them things at the expense of taxpayers. And if it means some heart attack victim will risk dying because he can't afford a hospital, well, he'll have to rely on the charity of others. I certainly won't have charity if it turns out he's some 300-pound walking piece of lard that didn't care about his health, figuring the taxpayers would cover him no matter what.

"Had Bush's plan not been done, do you think we'd have put that money on our pockets? We'd've gotten a Democratic plan that would not include any private insurance."

You are too willing to compromise, specifically about accepting government intervention in your life. I argued once with someone from the Manhattan Institute, which at best is semi-free market. She spoke one night this last March about why the MI supports the $20 billion project to build a major East Side subway corridor in Manhattan. Her stance came down to, "Well, we should spend the money anyway, because we'll be taxed."

As I put it, it's a massive welfare program for Upper East Side liberals to commute down to work, at the expense of state taxpayers (the New York MTA gets, what, $20 billion a year now in subsidies?). I refuse to compromise, I thundered. "We should never have to accept that because 50% of our income will be taxed, we might as well spend it this way or that. We should instead insist on 25%, 10%, and that government cut spending to match. Whatever happened to the Reagan revolution of limited government and low taxes?" I was the only person in the crowd who refused to accept her poppycock, and several after complimented me.

"Also with you on RomneyCare, enough so that I never looked at support the "Governor of the Commonwealth." Interesting to note that Part D produced lower premiums and less spending than was budgeted -- because it was based on free market principles."

There's nothing free market about it, but you did say "based on," which is not the same as functioning like the free market. On the surface it may seem similar, but once government taxes and spending come into play, the free market goes out the window.

Look at long-term costs, not today's. Now answer me, since when has a government program of indeterminate (read: infinite) life *not* grown larger and larger? I've not heard of a single one.

"NCLB is grey. I'm all for local control of the schools. But on this planet, that's not how it works."

The Constitution no longer works, and that's the only thing that counts. NCLB isn't gray at best, it's unconstitutional. None of the Articles specify such powers to the federal government, and the Tenth Amendment clearly reserves unspecified powers to the states and people.

"The AFT and NEA have effectively nationalized the schools. NCLB should not be needed, but the education system is so badly broken, Bush tried to buy accountability with Federal largesse. It's not my favorite but I do see it as part of the ownership society with the tax cuts, HSAs, private Social Security accounts, and Part D."

How is it an "ownership society" to violate the Constitution and give more power to the federal government? An "ownership society," notwithstanding the ludicrous nature of the term, is one where local people take local control of local schools -- not the other way around.

And frankly, I am baffled at how you can consider anything about Part D as part of an "ownership society," when it's merely the redistribution of wealth. But if by that you mean federal control, and begging government to let us do this and that though they're our inherent right to do in the first place, you are correct.

"I would have loved to have you on board to explain Bush's economic policies (instead of your buddy, Bruce Bartlett who failed so miserably but got a nice book deal)."

I've been meaning to post an unbiased review of Bartlett's book. He's not my friend, but Luskin is, and he and Luskin were friends. From what I understand, the book had no small part in them becoming embittered toward each other.

Bartlett said a lot of truth that needed to be said, that under Bush's watch, Congressional spending has gone unchecked at levels unseen since LBJ. Bartlett did say some unfair things, such as Bush's tax cuts not doing anything. Albeit moderate, the capital gains tax cut was critical for domestic investment.

"I have been complaining a lot lately about this administration's inability to articulate. What was cute in 2001 has become a threat to liberty in 2007. I am going to pick a great orator in 2008."

Many missed chances. When Bush and his staff pound on an issue, they did well, but that's a rarity. More often than not, they'd act spineless. Look at what happened to Mankiw when he defended outsourcing.

In Bush's place, I'd have called upon Paul Krugman and Brad DeLong to explain why outsourcing is bad. And if they started, I'd tell them on national TV to stick to the f****** point. Oh yeah, and fire the FCC head if he tried to fine me, since after all what's good for Bono (using it in a "non-sexual" way) ought to be good for anyone else. So vote for me in 2012, "The clear choice against incumbent Hillary."

Posted by: Perry Eidelbus at June 22, 2007 4:43 PM

Actually, Terri, I'm one of the nicest people in person that I see. However, when it comes to discussing economics, politics and religion, I'm ruthless.

I would similarly be ruthless were I in a position to "govern" others: I would govern by not governing, by being completely ruthless in preserving individual freedom.

"I happen to think that a lot of governing involves compromise not only amongst the governing bodies but amongst the people with their government itself."

There's the very problem. People accept "compromise," having been indoctrinated in public schools that wish only to turn out good, complacent citizens. They learn that "compromise" is "practical politics," which is true, but I don't want practical politics. I want righteous government that protects my life, liberty and property, not one that subsidizes my neighbors' lives and property at my expense.

Another problem is that people today think that when government functions by "the consent of the governed," it means majority rule. As the libertarian saying goes, democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding on lunch. Does "consent of the governed" mean "My neighbors consenting to make me pay for them" to you? Or does it mean as the Founding Fathers, the ultimate group of believers in freedom that history ever saw, believed, that it's MY consent to let government do away with MY property for MY benefit, and no one else's property or benefit?

"You jump right into accusing me of wanting to spend your hard earned dollars on me. I'm pretty sure I've avoided you at parties before."

I jumped in because you clearly think the redistribution of wealth is a good thing, and I want to know: are you benefiting on my tax dollars? It's a simple question. And at parties, I do tend to avoid people who I know live their lives courtesy of my money. Why would I want to associate with people who silently mug me?

"The people wanted "free drugs"."

Wrong. SOME people wanted free drugs, at OTHER people's expense.

"This prescription drug bill is a whole lot less of a give away than what you would have seen with someone other than Bush in office. (oh - unless you were there)"

Look again at future projected costs. Have you? I have, and you clearly have not. You need to know what you're talking about before you discuss it. The fact is that this giveaway will dwarf even LBJ's "War on Poverty."

I doubt you were around to see Lincoln's erosion of liberty. I wasn't, yet I don't need to have been "there" to know what happened.

"It's already less than projected."

Why not 10, or 20, or 30? Again, this is a government program of an indeterminate life span. It's going to grow and keep growing.

"Well - shall we go into the basics about being a part of society."

Just because I live near other people does not obligate me to pay for their living.

"I have no children and yet I get to pay for schools, I carry insurance and yet I get to pay for the Katrina disaster, I subsidize the railroads and the airlines and the roads and it goes on and on as you well know."

You shouldn't have to do any of those, don't you understand? Not a single one.

"(Don't bother. I'm sure you think everyone should just cover themselves and school themselves etc. I find a little benefit to having relatively educated people here and knowing there is a safety net in times of disaster)"

It's not anyone's responsibility to ensure others are competent. And btw, we keep expanding public schools yet have more and more idiot students graduating. It looks bad for government schools, you know, so they just dumb down the standards and pass students who shouldn't have been. They also don't kick out troublemakers who disrupt classes. Private schools wouldn't get away with this.

"Life is about choices. And sometimes its the voters who choose for you."

Take a principled stand. Why should others get to decide how to live your life, how to live their lives at your expense? What obligates you?

"The pharmaceutical companies, the left, the right, the hmos and the old folks all contributed to this bill. And frankly it's a good one. Perhaps not to you who would rather live in a cave and not be a part of society, but to many others it's working out. Should we even have medicare at all? Maybe not. But we do."

Of course people love to live at the expense of others. They "contribute" ideas, and I contribute dollars. And you think it's *right*?

"I don't think the money comes out of thin air."

You seem to think so. You also seem to think there's no adverse effect on the economy when government takes tax dollars that would have otherwise been invested or spent on things people deemed more efficient. It's not "efficient" just because your neighbors decide what to do with your money.

Posted by: Perry Eidelbus at June 22, 2007 5:01 PM

"I compromise too much." That's a fair cop, guv. You'll find plenty of folks around here that will agree with you on that. I'll counter that your don't-give-an-inch does not serve the cause of liberty.

I can't defend Miers's nomination, but in the end it was pulled and Bush's two picks have been stellar. Was it party loyalty? I don't know, I can't think of even a bad reason for that one. Being a Buffy fan, it has to be a spell or some demonic possession. But it wore off and we got Justice Alito.

But I will stand up for the ownership society and Part D. You refuse to admit that it is built on market principles and that is unfair. The rest of Medicare is single payer; part D has private insurers competing for subscribers. As such, it is the one government program that has surprised to the downside both in cost to the government and average premiums to its subscribers.

A future administration might build on those figures to spread market mechanisms into the rest of Medicare. The idea of the ownership society is that these mechanisms function like seed crystals. Over time, they become a larger percentage of the structure and crowd out the collectivist portion. It is a bold attempt and it may not work, but it is disingenuous not to recognize the attempt.

You applauded the try for private Social Security accounts -- that's the exact same thing. Had legislation progressed, there was much talk of increasing benefits to sell it to the Democrats. Were you being a Socialist? Perry was trying to take my money against my will and give it to seniors! What a Communist that Perry is!

McClellan did not last long enough, but there was improvement in his tenure. Fast track approvals for terminal conditions and the Pharma funded faster approval process both happened under his watch. (Sadly, I think he was pulled off to do Part D -- that was a dark day for me).

I got a kick out of your prison sodomy line, but I think you are missing the saddest fact there is. Welfare for seniors is wildly popular beyond those who accept benefits. People like the idea of a safety net for themselves, their parents, and think that it is a component of "a just society."

Nine percent libertarians according to Pew. The other 91% are, sadly, very cool with collectivist, nationalized health care and pensions for the elderly. If you will not admit that, you will not be successful in a Madisonian democracy.

Posted by: jk at June 23, 2007 11:48 AM

Hey a fight at Three Sources and JK IS in it!

And handling my position just fine (and probably better than I).....I think I'll take the day off.

Posted by: Terri at June 24, 2007 9:01 AM

"I'll counter that your don't-give-an-inch does not serve the cause of liberty."

It does not work today not because it isn't the right thing to do, but because so many people prefer "the tranquility of servitude" and the peace of compromise, being too afraid of the "extreme" of full-blown God-given rights.

We fought for independence because we refused to give in, because real liberty is not won with compromise or "accepting" that certain things cannot be. As a matter of "practical politics" (a phrase I often use), sure, elections aren't won by extreme candidates. But which do you want to win, centrist candidates, or the cause of real liberty?

"Braveheart" had a couple of great lines on how far one is willing to go. The Elder Bruce maintained, "But it is exactly the ability to compromise that makes a man noble." It is easy for people to compromise when their livelihoods are based on power, whether they wield it (politicians) or derive benefits from it (welfare state recipients). When the Princess of Wales offered Wallace the king's bribe, he retorted, "Slaves are made in such ways!"

"But I will stand up for the ownership society and Part D. You refuse to admit that it is built on market principles and that is unfair."

I refuse to admit it because it's patently false. The very fact that government is intervening (i.e. taking money from some people to give to others) means it is NOT free-market. Something can be based on "market principles," but that is NOT the same as a free market where people make purely voluntarily transactions. This is not John Kerry nuance. It's plain fact.

You can keep arguing "ownership society" until you're blue in the face, but it's an absurd phrase while Social Security and Medicare taxes are coerced out of my salary.

"The rest of Medicare is single payer; part D has private insurers competing for subscribers."

Via an infrastructure that government created, thus skewing market forces. Again, not free market.

"As such, it is the one government program that has surprised to the downside both in cost to the government and average premiums to its subscribers."

Which is only so far. People think they can keep credit card under control, too, but how much will they restrain themselves when they're borrowing money in other people's names? Not much.

I will point out for the umpteenth time that even the most conservative estimates show the program has high long-term costs to make Social Security look cheap. Have you ever looked at the full projections? I have.

"A future administration might build on those figures to spread market mechanisms into the rest of Medicare."

Again, it's only the skewing of free market forces. You need to understand the difference between "market forces" that have the appearance of the free market and what is truly the free market.

"The idea of the ownership society is that these mechanisms function like seed crystals. Over time, they become a larger percentage of the structure and crowd out the collectivist portion. It is a bold attempt and it may not work, but it is disingenuous not to recognize the attempt."

That I "recognize" the attempt is a ridiculous demand when the process is just another instance of government intervention. Not recognizing the programs for their proto-socialism IS what is disingenuous.

A real ownership society is one where government butts out and allows people to function on their own. History proves, time and time again, that all the planting of seeds will do is create a larger and larger bureaucracy. Look back to FDR's New Deal, and its constantly failed attempts that kept the U.S. mired in depression. Should we have "recognized the attempt" that he was "pragmatic" in his belief that government needed to "prime the pump"?

"You applauded the try for private Social Security accounts -- that's the exact same thing. Had legislation progressed, there was much talk of increasing benefits to sell it to the Democrats. Were you being a Socialist? Perry was trying to take my money against my will and give it to seniors! What a Communist that Perry is!"

Private accounts are very different from Plan D, because you're using your own money. It's not really free market because the state forces you to save, but you're not being given someone else's money to save. The rest of Social Security is complete socialism, however, just like Plan D. It's a very simple test: is government taking money from someone to give to you?

I support real privatization, namely the abolishment of the whole thing, but I will support private accounts as a first step. It's not enough, but it's legally important: it could force the SCOTUS to recognize people's legitimate claim on what they paid in. You may recall that it ruled otherwise in 1943.

"McClellan did not last long enough, but there was improvement in his tenure. Fast track approvals for terminal conditions and the Pharma funded faster approval process both happened under his watch. (Sadly, I think he was pulled off to do Part D -- that was a dark day for me)."

Which comes down to begging government for permission to do what is our natural right in the first place.

"I got a kick out of your prison sodomy line, but I think you are missing the saddest fact there is. Welfare for seniors is wildly popular beyond those who accept benefits. People like the idea of a safety net for themselves, their parents, and think that it is a component of "a just society." "

Oh, don't think I realize that. Limousine liberals aren't the only ones who feel "good" about coercing others into charity. Liberalism is all about generosity, after all: generosity with other people's money.

"Nine percent libertarians according to Pew. The other 91% are, sadly, very cool with collectivist, nationalized health care and pensions for the elderly. If you will not admit that, you will not be successful in a Madisonian democracy."

It does depend on the question's phrasing. If you ask someone, "Do you believe that people are entitled to the fruits of their labor," they may not realize it's completely at odds with, "Do you believe government should provide a safety net?"

Ask people if they're willing to support Part D to help seniors, then ask them if they're willing to pay massive tax hikes to fund it. Or ask them if they're willing to tax "the top 1% of taxpayers," notwithstanding it's that 1% that provide the business management, savings and investment to create jobs for the rest of us.

Posted by: Perry Eidelbus at June 26, 2007 5:58 PM

I forgot to comment further on Roberts and Alito. I'm not saying Bush nominated a pair of Souters. They're actually not bad, but they've disappointed me with past and present rulings. A while back, Professor Bainbridge had a great entry on why "originalist," "textualist" and "strict constructionist," which are often used interchangeably, are really different. So I really wasn't concerned if they were like Scalia and Thomas, who themselves have disappointed me. I don't care if someone's conservative, libertarian or liberal: my single test is how faithfully he will defend the Constitution.

Originally I said on my blog that Alito would be a good choice, and he could well be in the end, but I have a feeling his dispositions might be a problem for our freedom at some point in the future. For example, his dissent in Doe v. Groody was inexcusable. Granted it was when he was a federal appeals court justice, but it shows he's too willing to give police the benefit of the doubt. As my friend Billy Beck charged, the police are a part of government that has no right of presumptive innocence when charged with wrongdoing, by the very fact that they are pre-authorized to use force on behalf of the people.

Now, getting specific with Roberts, his ruling in Hedgepeth v. Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority was completely inexcusable. That sets the tone for what will happen in the future, I'm afraid. Also, is he consistent? It bothered me during his testimony to the Sente Judiciary Committee that he said he'd be obliged to respect SCOTUS precedent. That doesn't jive at all when he said the Court was correct to rule as it did in Brown v. Board. As you may recall, it was a reversal of Plessy v. Ferguson. So which one does Roberts really believe? Did he say what he did before the committee just to placate abortion litmus test liberals, or will he rule as a matter of convenience for the politics of the president who nominated him?

Pretty good nominees overall, but it's that fraction that may come back to bite us.

Posted by: Perry Eidelbus at June 26, 2007 10:36 PM | What do you think? [12]